It is currently Sat Oct 19, 2019 11:13 am




 Page 2 of 4 [ 51 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2013 1:05 am 
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2003 8:15 am
Posts: 1372
Location: netherlands
I have to check Gyruss, perhaps it's not compatible with the 4.8.06 MyBIOS..... :P

Seven Cities, I'll check to.
I only patched internal SIO to do JMP SIOV, perhaps there is some ending-code that
set some other bytes in memory to control the game. I just played it shortly to check
if you can swap disks. Did you use shift+control+P to un-protect the disk #2 after
swapping? Perhaps the game wan't to save something and images are read-only by default.

Both checks: Not today, Today I'm away, so during next week.
Hang-on :)

I did not write FAT32-loader, sorry.
So I can't change it.
But you can use a hex-editor to lengthen a file to match 720 sector disks?
Just pad a file with extra zeros until it reaches 92.176 bytes = 720 sectors.

Later!
Sijmen.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2013 4:01 pm 
User avatar

Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2003 4:37 pm
Posts: 228
Location: Arizona USA
phoenixdownita wrote:
FAT32Loader doesn't support k-file ATR, can you add a "padding"/force option to load it anyway [like myidetool does when adding it to images space]?

Try this thread for a program that will correct K-file atrs . I have used it on all my K-files for use with MyIDE II..

viewtopic.php?p=6226#p6226

Details for usage is in that post..



_________________
RoyE
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2013 5:51 pm 

Joined: Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:53 pm
Posts: 34
roye wrote:
phoenixdownita wrote:
FAT32Loader doesn't support k-file ATR, can you add a "padding"/force option to load it anyway [like myidetool does when adding it to images space]?

Try this thread for a program that will correct K-file atrs . I have used it on all my K-files for use with MyIDE II..

viewtopic.php?p=6226#p6226

Details for usage is in that post..


Thanks but it misses the point. myidetool already support forcing loading of non std ATR when importing in Image space. Alternatively as suggested I could simply patch the file to the right size, but that is beside the point.
It would be nice if FAT32Loader simply allows it, basically auto patch to the right size with all zero.
With ATRUtil I can already extract the content of suck Kboot disks, which is usually an EXE so no pb there, I would just like to avoid using any PC tool altogether and let the FAT32Loader do it on the fly.

EDIT: found a bug in FAT32 loader. If I have 2 directory with same initial name it gets confused. For example "Ninja" and "Ninja Commando" (with a space) or "Tower" and "Tower Toppler" (with a space). the list is correct but once you chose the second directory (the one with a space) it really loads up the first (without the space), once I replaced the space with underline it worked fine ["Ninja" and "Ninja_Commando", and "Tower" and "Tower_Toppler"].
Who do we tell the bug?


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:02 am 
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2003 8:15 am
Posts: 1372
Location: netherlands
ATARIMAX did write the FAT32-loader, so you need to inform him.
If the loader does not accept chopped ATR's you need to change them yourself.
And I'm not talking about the ATR's you drag/drop into image-space.

I did some digging into Seven Cities and it seems it uses reserved bytes in
the OS currently used for IDE_access. For now I leave this game as incompatible, sorry.
Perhaps I can do some changes in the OS to leave these bytes free, but for now
don't count on it.

Gyruss I still need to check.

Later,
Sijmen.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:08 am 

Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2004 10:34 am
Posts: 259
Location: NL
One more thing to add here:

Why bothering with K-boot disks? These disks do contain .XEX binaries, which are converted back to a bootable atr.
All those files do exist as a .XEX file. Simply get those files, and put them on your FAT32 area.

The only games that need image boot, are those games that do not exist as binary file.

I think I am a diehard atari 8bit user, and I almost never need a game on .ATR image.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:15 pm 

Joined: Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:53 pm
Posts: 34
Sysop*Marius wrote:
One more thing to add here:

Why bothering with K-boot disks? These disks do contain .XEX binaries, which are converted back to a bootable atr.
All those files do exist as a .XEX file. Simply get those files, and put them on your FAT32 area.

The only games that need image boot, are those games that do not exist as binary file.

I think I am a diehard atari 8bit user, and I almost never need a game on .ATR image.


The reason to support k-boot is just so we don't need to either search for the XEX/EXE version or pad it by hand.
In my experimentation for example I noticed that Gyruss(v1) kboot ATR file works from myBIOS image, does not from FAT32Loader [expected for now] and the associated XEX also does not work [I can't remember if I actually extracted the EXE within the kboot ATR]
{you can try youself form here http://atarionline.pl/v01/index.php?ct= ... uss#Gyruss}.
So there is some difference in treatment between myBios/FAT32loader that may point to underlying bugs but because I can't just use directly the same source it's hard to assert [I know in this instance I could have just padded the kboot atr].

I understand it is just a convenience feature, but so are half a dozen already implemented.
It will simplify dealing with those non-standard and yet standard enough kboot ATRs.

I am no purist I just want to play, the only purist part is that I would prefer no hack/trainer if possible unless the game wouldn't work any other way. For example R16 I approve as unless the flash cart implements the ROM mappers, there's no other way to play those on stock 64K ATARIs.

But I am digressing, I should start a thread with ATARIMAX which I believe is "classics" aka Steve, right?
I know he's busy at the moment so not much chance of a quick fix but it should be noted anyway.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 3:17 pm 

Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2004 10:34 am
Posts: 259
Location: NL
I understand your point. The reality though is that ATR support will always be disappointing.

The reason is that booting an IMAGE requiers a replacement OS in the Atari. That is why OSB.ROM is requierd on your FAT32 partition.

This creates a workaround, that is not extremely compatible.

The MyBIOS Mr.Atari created is more compatible.

If you want to boot images, use MyBIOS... and then go for the MyBIOS in ROM, which is extremely compatible.

Booting ATR files just from the FAT32 area on an unmodified atari 8bit computer will always be a no-go.

If you do not want to modify your atari, I seriously would search for working fie versions of your games. It will take some time, but once you found what you want or need, you are done.

I have a giant collection of .XEX files on my FAT32 partition, and when I'm on vacation I bring my MyIDE cart with me, and play all those games.

If you want to modify your atari for this, burn the MyBIOS rom in an Eprom and replace the Atari OS with that eprom. You'll love it, it's nice.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:35 pm 

Joined: Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:53 pm
Posts: 34
phoenixdownita wrote:
...

EDIT: found a bug in FAT32 loader. If I have 2 directory with same initial name it gets confused. For example "Ninja" and "Ninja Commando" (with a space) or "Tower" and "Tower Toppler" (with a space). the list is correct but once you chose the second directory (the one with a space) it really loads up the first (without the space), once I replaced the space with underline it worked fine ["Ninja" and "Ninja_Commando", and "Tower" and "Tower_Toppler"].
Who do we tell the bug?


The bug is not related to using spaces in names but in having more than 256 subdir in the same dir. When that happens the sorting is a little off and the code seems to be getting confused when dirs are selected as to which one of the list exaclty was selected. Once I made sure none of my dir as more than 255 subdir it all started to get back to normal.

Sorry for the false alarm, maybe a warning on the manual would be good or something in the UI oo a simple error message stating dir too big > 255 (or 256 whatever that may be).

EDIT:
Actually the bug is there and it manifests when you have two or more directories with the name of one been the prefix of the rest and when the first different character is a space.
For example:
Tower
Tower Toppler

when attempting to enter the "Tower Toppler" directory the list is actually for "Tower", this is true for games like:
Arkanoid
Arkanoid II
Arkanoid III

both II and III will list the content of "Arkanoid" instead.

For now I found a solution by appending one char (like "-") to the end of the short name (as in Arkanoid-), I think the bug deserves to be fixed.


Last edited by phoenixdownita on Tue Oct 08, 2013 11:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:38 pm 

Joined: Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:53 pm
Posts: 34
Sysop*Marius wrote:
I understand your point. The reality though is that ATR support will always be disappointing.

...

If you want to modify your atari for this, burn the MyBIOS rom in an Eprom and replace the Atari OS with that eprom. You'll love it, it's nice.


Yeah, I believe that is the way to go. I will need a heat gun and an eprom burner but I think i can handle it.
I will bug Sijmen once i got all ready so I can have a 64K EPROM host original XEGS and MrBIOS in the same chip just for fun and to gain that extra compatibility.

Do you know or have an idea of what percentage of games has issues with Soft OS? Would you say more or less than 10%?


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 1:58 am 
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2003 8:15 am
Posts: 1372
Location: netherlands
I like the MrBIOS name-variation :)


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 12:07 am 

Joined: Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:53 pm
Posts: 34
I decided to bite the bullet and bought 1 heat gun, 1 eprom programmer and 1 eprom eraser.
They will arrive likely in 3 or 4 weeks [eBay, chinese seller].
First task will be to socket the BIOS, if that works fine I will ask you for the 64KB image with both the stock XEGS and R2. If that goes wrong I will not have an Atari anymore :( at that point.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 1:40 am 
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2003 8:15 am
Posts: 1372
Location: netherlands
Normal step is to remove the current OS, place a socket and put the removed OS in the socket.
Then test the system. If is works, it works :)
If not, check if there are connections gone between upper/lower PCB and correct them.
I never killed a Atari and wasn't able to restore the damage.....

China stuff is cheap and it works!


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 6:34 am 
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2003 8:15 am
Posts: 1372
Location: netherlands
Gyruss 16k cartridge, patched not to clear D5xx


There are images and/or files attached to this posting. You must be logged-in to view or download this content.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 9:21 pm 

Joined: Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:53 pm
Posts: 34
mr-atari wrote:
Gyruss 16k cartridge, patched not to clear D5xx


Yeah, it works!!!!!


Thanks so much.

But .... you know there was one coming ... right ? :)

I believe all the Gyruss images xex/bin are kind of broken as far as music is concerned.
I never played the Atari 800 [no XL/XE] version but I did play the C64 and remember that the music is looping around on the stages as well as the title screen.
Well all the images I managed to play instead get to a point either on the title screen or the first stage where the music is kind of missing [2 voices are missing while the background is still there]. The second stage actually has the music continuation [that should be looped with the one from stage one] and it is longer but eventually also ends up not looping and with the same missing 2 voices and only background.
Not sure, maybe it only works on 800 or it requires some fixing in the music department.
As you spent time fixing it, if you have time maybe it's worth a look. Just leave the game in the title screen and it should be obvious, it takes probably 1 min before the music is just the background rhythm and missing the foreground melody.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Help with using multi disk ATR or ATR in general as imag
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 1:39 am 
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2003 8:15 am
Posts: 1372
Location: netherlands
I tried my own Parker cartridge Gyruss.
The music also dies as you say.
So I guess it's in the game like that.
Does not matter on what system you try.
400/800 1200XL XL or XE


Offline
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 Page 2 of 4 [ 51 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

cron